Direct2Dell

Hi everyone,

To make sure that everyone has the most up to date information about this NVIDIA GPU issue please review Lionel's fourth post, which can be found here.   We're turning off comments on these older posts but you're welcome to read and post your comments or concerns on that thread.

Dell XPS Gen 2 has NVIDIA graphics card problem too.  Rang Dell but the laptop is out of warranty - quoted £350 for onsite repair!! 

I own a Precision M90 notebook and my Nvidia Quadro 2500 GPU failed on 12/29/2008. I have "next business day" warranty and I called Dell Italy technical support the same day it happened, but as today (01/15/2009) they didn't yet substitute my graphic card, saying they have problems resupplying new GPUs from Nvidia. When I bought my M90 I came from a bad support experience and I preferred Dell over other vendors exactly because they had "next business day" support: now you can imagine how upset I am after 15 days waiting and with no certain date for problem solution. I have two questions:

1) How long should I wait for for my notebook to be repaired? Can I hope to have it fixed within January?

2) Why Precision M90 is not eligible for the "limited warranty enhancement"? It has the same kind of Nvidia GPU as the others, with exactly the same kind of problems but I don't see it in the table.

Dell have not listed the M1710 or the nvidia 7900 series cards as having these issues. My 1710 runs the 7950gtx, I am now onto my third card. Same symptoms as the 8400/8600 series cards, overheating, bluescreens, wireless card issues. The system runs so hot the Windows authentication sticker on the base of the laptop has burnt through.

My system has experienced these issues since delivery from Dell over 16 months ago. My brother purchased his M1710 8 months ago, again with the 7950gtx card and 3 months ago started having the exact same issues, coincidence?

How many other M1710 owners have these same issues?

I own an M1330 and the motherboard also went 2 months after the warranty had expired, I called Dell and they wanted to charge me 50 bucks to diagnose this over the phone.  Obviously I did not take the bait and I told them that I would never promote or buy another Dell product again, as far as I'm concerned when my neighbors and friends ask me I will tell them to buy anything but Dell.

for posterity, this was the look of the problem on my xps1330 with this error

Again and again, the impossible problem is solved when we see that the problem is only a tough decision waiting to be made !

I have an XPS1330 which is affacted by it's GPU fail. But the other problem is my region that I live there which there isn't any official DELL support here (IRAN) ! What can I do now ? I really need your help.

Thank you in advance.

Hi, I'm having power problem with my monitor on Dell Latitude C640.  It keeps shuting down after being turn on within a minute or so.  It works fine if I connect to another monitor externally.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Can someone here tell me what percent of the computers with Navidea cards are going to fail. I bought this from someone on the net and later found out it might not now be transferrable? Shouldn't Dell fix them anyway within warranty period?Couldn't have Dell sold a bunch of these wholesale thru second party knowing the wholesaler didn't have Dell Warranty? The people stuck should have a warranty?: Basically I love the computer but  I would like to know what percent are failing? Are more failing with a certain processor then others? Please someone help.

Hi Todd,

Thanks for the reply. I had read the other posts, and even currently have them open in other windows/tabs.

I have called warranty tech support numerous times today, and talked to 4 different people all of which keep telling me that my system is out of warranty and that I need to call the out-of-warranty number.

I would like one number that can be called, and talk to one person about this issue as I am tired of being transferred to someone else every 10 minutes or so. If I am supposed to call the out-of-warranty number first, then the blog postings should say that. If this item is being covered under warranty, then I should not have to call the other numbers. THis is what is frustrating me the most.

So who do I call to resolve this.

I have one of the infected Dell Inspiron 1420 laptops, and the NVIDIA GPU has died on this. Of course it dies 3 weeks after the warranty expired like it was set to do that. I want to know what Dell plans to do about this as their so-called Tech support (clueless people) have no interest in dealing with customers' issues; just passing us off to another department again and again.

I know that NVIDIA is paying Dell for this issue, and I do not see why Dell is charging the customers for the repair. Dell is getting paid twice for the same problem.

Dell, What are you going to do to repair my laptop, and everyone else's that is affected by this problem with the NVIDIA GPUs???

I have a d630 and while I literally love this thing, as it works better then any laptop I ever owned its starting to act up. i get a message that its going to close down (dump something error message) at least once a day but its fast to reboot and work again but you still know this shouldn't happen. Also this thing works very warm and even though it has a bio update when I go to dell website I think there is another bios update listed, are there two?

One wonder with the fan going on so much and this thing running very warm how long a lifespan this thing has. Its great to use for like 20 minutes before I worry about it overheating. This should not have to happen.  Having said that the intell 9500 chip is very speedy and cool . I just wish dell would id what percent of the people with these computers need replacement and just do it.

I've had this issue recently where my lap-top can not detect the motherboard. So I simply reinstall the working system (Vista) and everything is back to normal.

As far as I've noticed, programs that (say an old version of ACT6! or home brood programs or downloads) aren't fully compatible with the system will cause strange things to happen.

Unfortunately, I use older programs and I've run into this issue. When I remove the non-compatible programs, my XPS1330 runs fine, but when I reinstall them, a few days later, it all goes to hell.

I hope this is helpful to some of you.

Hi Guys!

Looks like we're better off solving these problems ourselves.

As an owner of a Dell XPS M1710, my solution/preventative-maintenance to this "overheating" problem, was to change the thermal compound to Arctic Silver 5, add a laptop cooler (Zalman ZM-NC2000) & Most importantly download and install I8kfanGUI. I configured I8kfanGUI, so that the fan automatically turns on earlier for both the GPU and CPU. I found this improvement to be extremely effective, the laptop is never hot anymore! :) I don't care about the fan noise since the laptop would be connected to  monitor speakers during gaming.

As a note, depending on your system the GPU may utilize both fans in the laptop, so you can have both fans set at slow speed during normal use and have them kick in to high when gaming.

Down the road, once this nVidia GPU nightmare has been solved, the only thing that Dell can do to ensure customer loyalty, is to get Nvidia to make a driver that throttles down during less graphic intense usage and then throttles up-but more efficiently. This is what ATI cards do. You got to give the underdogs kudos for this. I find it very abnormal for a laptop to idle at such high temperatures.

If your laptop is still under warranty, I would advise not to open the laptop and replace the thermal compound. If you have a Dell tech coming to your house to replace a component, you can ask if he/she can use some of the Arctic Silver 5 compound that you conveniently happen to have on your desk at the time. :) Ironically, some Dell techs recommend opening your laptop to clean the dust, go figure.

If your laptop is not under warranty, and you are concerned about the overheating problem, then I would say go ahead and change the thermal compound. Be sure to polish both of the copper heatsinks (this increases the surface contact between the GPU/CPU & heatsink) , then CLEAN it with min. 70% rubbing alcohol.

Be careful when you open your laptop, the hinge cover can be a real pain, USE those plastic scribes that you would use to open an iPod. Take all the time you need to open the hinge cover successfully. Once open, its relatively straight forward. Make sure you ground yourself once in a while (touch the metal tap on your sink). Clean the GPU & CPU while they are still mounted - no need to remove them (unless you want to upgrade). Follow the application instructions from the Arctic Silver 5 website. When you remove screws from the unit, it is easy to remember which one goes where, since there are indicators. Take lots of photos in case you are in doubt.

Like they say, every little thing counts, so the more you can do to help keep your laptop cool, the better.

You'll note that even downloading and installing I8kfanGUI or other fan control utilities make a big difference. Even though we all know these laptops are a big pain in the neck, they are still the sweetest things since the birth of the automatic transmission. So its worth doing what we can to make them last. I mean damn, I still have a ten year old Toshiba that still works. There should be no reason why these new Dells can't last that long either.

Thanks for your comments guys, we have 10 x M4300 workstations that do long hours and are often taken home by design engineers. They are roughly 6 months old now all with fresh OS and latest drivers. Nearly all of them have had serious issues mostly in relation to the GPUs. Dell Technical support are great and have someone out within two days to replace whatever is wrong. The problem is now the replaced motherboards are starting to fail. This is going to be big for Nvidia and their suppliers/customers. The Dell customer care however has been totally useless saying that this is a technical support issue and bouncing me back to technical support when we need the units replaced with different models.

Not to dismiss the problem with the laptops, but the product is made by ATI not dell and if dell bought 500,000 of these cards and built 500.000 laptops premade and ready to go out the door for sale, and ATI states that a bios upgrade will fix this issue, then why would you rip out all these video cards and replace them..  Seriously.  Same thing goes with your home, if you have a leaky pipe and you call a plumber and he says a little patch with fix the problem, do you make him remove all the plumbing the the house incase there is more problem than that leak and throw them away when he has reassured you that the patch with work prefectly.  The chip gets a little hotter than normal.  increase the fan performance and the problem is fixed.  as long as it is remaining at a good temp there is no problem (And its not like there was not major overheating issues with ATI cards in the past)..  but if anyone has to come good for the product it is not dell it is ATI, they have to admit that the bios upgrade is not going to work over the long haul.  You have to remember that they told dell that there is no need to panic the cards are stll good that this bios update will fix the problem, keep on using them up..  ATI is not going to want dell to return any of them; they do not want that loss. 

cartman, the error code is #M1004, its for system overheating. i have the same problem too and i hope they can give all us with defective GPU replacement to a upgraded cooling system or something.

my XPS M1530 having serious overheating issue. my CPU hit 94 Celsius and my GPU hit 90 Celsius and i gave DELL a call. They told me thats the normal temperature. my fan is switched on most of the time and my idle temp is around 65 to 70 Celsius.

I'm having some gaming problems, the game is not as smooth as used to be(when i just only bought the laptop).

DELL refused to do anything bout it, they kept asking for error codes. Since when overheating has an error code?

i have been having trouble with my pc for about two months ..i have call dell and have not returned my call. its not a soft ware problem and all i want is for then to come out and fix my pc. i have warrenty and they have been giving me the run around. im so tried of this.. my children need the pc for homework and for now since the begining of september they have to go to the libary, which is not fare to me or them. and if any thing happends to my children because of this problem with my pc i will hold dell responsible.

Hi ,

I want buy laptop full option.  Could you please sand me the specifications for last laptop on my E-mail as soon possible

I have an XPS M1330 purchased eight months ago, in January 2008.  It worked fine for seven months, then the video system failed.  The screen began to flicker wildly.

Dell was quick to offer a new motherboard.  The tech disassembled most of my computer.  Two hours later it was broken, and far worse than before.  The screen flicker went from 25% of the screen, 25% of the time, to 25% of the screen almost all the time.

I was ready for a replacement but Dell refused and insisted the depot could handle it no problem.  Dell was quick.  It came back within 48 hours.  And 15 minutes out of the box, it failed again.  There was no note to explain what Dell fixed or did not fix, and so I had no way of knowing if Dell even looked at it.  It got worse when I called, as various techs said it was the cable, the LCD, the camera, the motherboard.

Despite many calls, Dell refuses to provide a good computer.  Dell insists on disassembling and reassembling this one for a third time.  It has gotten considerably worse each time.  I can barely read what I am typing now (I can only read it by moving the window around).  After all these mistakes, Dell should be rushing to provide a new computer and protect its reputation; instead they refuse.

I have a M1330 that is 1 year and 11 days old.  I had a failure in May and the motherboard had to be replaced and yesterday the graphics card failed again.  I am 10 days out of warranty.  I called Dell and they were great.  The warranty has been extended by 12 months and a tech will be at my home tomarrow to fix the computer.  I think this is Nvidia's failure and Dell is doing a nice job of taking care of their customers.  I own two M1330's only one has had problems.  The newer one is about 8 months old so hopefully the problem is isolated.

Hi, I bought a Inspiron 1520 a year ago. My pc has a GeForce 8600GT and It has theses issues.  I upgraded my Bios, but my computer has the same problems. Why my computer is not covered??

Hi,

I had recently purchased a Dell Vostro 1200 and had sufferred with such a bad experience which cant be expected from a company of international repute. Earlier also I am the dell user and have been using the Inspiron notbook since last 2 years and truly it was my after sales experience for which I had again choosen the dell but this time it's a nightmare. I can't even think that a company like dell may go to such a worst level in just 2 years.

I had called customer care executives for 4 times and every time I had to wait for atleast 20 - 30 mins than one executive pick up the phone asks the service tag and again they put me on hold untill I had disconnected further when I had tried to chat online there is a message that you are next in queue after 40-45 mins and than no one had turned up to answer further the worst is that when I had tried to mail to the dell than system had shown the following message

We apologise, but we could not send the email as our email system is currently unavailable. Please try again later.

Now any one can think that what worst the dell had turned up in just two years.

I believe there are 2 issues which are combining to escalate the situation:

1. The Thermal Sensitivity of the NVIDIA chips

2. A bug in the fan control of some dell laptops

I have had my Dell xps m1530 for 2 weeks.  Noticing that it seems to get hotter than other laptops I have used, I have (luckily) been hyper-aware of fan operation.  Suddenly, the fan on my xps just stopped working allowing the thing to get way too hot.  It didn't even come on briefly when I'd reboot (multiple times.)  I found the following site wherin others have linked this issue to the dell wireless card:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=265142&page=2

Sure enough when I toggled connect/disconnect and rebooted, the fan worked normally.  (In my tests the fan seems to quit working properly if there is a wireless connection up at either sleep or shutdown)

There also may be issues with the system waking itself up out of sleep and/or rebooting on shutdown as if restart were selected.  Since these are circumstances which may trigger the fan problem for wireless users (with a dell card), it raises the specter of a running, unattended - perhaps stored - laptop with a non-functioning fan containing an nvidia gpu which has thermal issues.

I'm feeling pretty bad about my purchasing descision about now...

Hi,

I almost purchased a 1310 with a Nvidia GPU in Germany yesterday and finaly didnt, because I read about alle the Nvidia issues.

Like all others I would really like to know, if the issue is fixed. By that I dont mean a bios fix with extra fan power. I mean if a new Vostro 1310 will have a fixed GPU from the start.

The price attractive packege I interested in is only in Germany with Nvidia GPU. I dont understand why Dell doesnt offer a free downgrade instead of selling a GPU with known issues and the risk that customes get disappointed.

So, how is the GPU of freshly delivered 1310 Vostros???

My Vostro 1500 makes that horrible eeeee noise.  Is there a bios update for it?

Hi, i have a vostro 1500 with a 8600M GT and i'm certainly suffering from crashing problems during games and extreme heating, the only bios update i found is A06 but i'm not sure if applying that, is it really useful or causes more troubles?

I bought my M1330 last year, this followed a purchase of another XPS a couple years ago, my M170.  I love my M170, a great purchase, in fact I'm still using it....and you can all guess why...

The 1330 began screwing up, sent it in for warranty, came back with a new mobo.

Now, I've just done a fresh install of Vista (yes, the one that came with it) due to a hard drive failure but my video woes continue.  I've updated the BIOS as per the hyperlinks above but I have an aggravating problem.  I cannot install the 8400 driver.  Well..I can but the computer will not boot unless it is in safe mode where I then have to remove the driver so it can be restarted and boot normally.

When vista tries to install a driver or boot using the driver the screen goes blank and I have to do a hard reboot, safe mode,  and 'remove driver routine.'

Oddly, when it finally rights itself and boots 'normally' I have 32bit color and high resolution as though I have something other than the basic VGA driver installed.

Like an idiot, I've referred a number of friends to this line of laptops...and guess what?  Now I look a bit silly explaining to them how a best-of-breed company appears to be waiting until every computer is outside the warranty period so that their liability is limited.

I have wasted 1800 dollars on a computer that has never worked properly.  And the only people I can talk to about it are Indians that I can barely understand.  Why do Americans get other Americans to talk to while us Canucks get Indians and Filipinos?

I'm going to give this another month or two and then, out of principle look at some legal options.  I can afford any laptop, but I just want one that works and I'm unsatisfied with Dell's response.

does anyone know if this happens in safe mode as well for the m1330. my laptop started showing vertical lines yesterday...   = (

I have an XPS  M1330 that as of a week is now entirely useless. It started shutting off, displaying only vertical lines, and now does not turn on at all. Hooking it up to another monitor makes no difference. I have half a book on that laptop. I paid $3K+ a little over a year ago; my warranty expired in July. 

This seems to be a well-known problem with people on this site and the one posted below yet two Dell techinical support people told me (i) to take it to Best Buy for repair, and (ii), I could send it in to Dell for repair, which I would have to pay for. I have bought 2 tvs, 2 laptops and 2 PCs from Dell, because of their excellent customer service.

In this case, I am shocked at what Dell employees have told me. I am computer illiterate but do know that my mother board is dead from normal use during just a year. This means there are inherent problems with the hardware. This should be covered and repaired by Dell at no cost to me. I don't know what to do now. I leave for an extended work trip in a month and know that it would not be possible to send the laptop to Dell, have it repaired and sent back before I leave. The Dell tech support person who said I could sent it in to Dell for repair said I could receive a box within 8-10 days in which I could send it back to Dell, await the repair and have it sent back to me. This would clearly take several weeks.

HELP! Any advice would be appreciated, not to mention quick Dell intervention.

Thanks.

http://getsatisfaction.com/dell/topics/dell_xps_m1330_problems_with_graphics_video_driver

I just bought my wife a D830  for her BUSINESS. She complained about the fan running all the time. I thought she was exaggerating or it might be  the 4GB of non-Dell RAM I put in. Maybe the "fix" is in already to make fan run all the time.

I bought my daughter an M65 for school 2 years ago. 4 MOBOs and 2 replacement M65's later she is still having issues when watching videos on it. Thank God for the 3 year warranty.

Got to go make sure I got my wife the 3yr warranty....

BTW No problems with D810 or D610 both ~3yrs old

Does anybody know why Dell didnt include the XPS m1210 in there bios updates.  I personally have had my m1210 laptop die.  A month after warrenty was up.  Ive read about 40 reviews from other people having this same problem.  This is rediculus.

One other thing.  I have had the erratic touch pad issue, the randome characters flashing on my screen, the blue screen and reboot problem as well.  Now I know the problem is the faulty GPU and I think Dell needs to use another GPU in these boards.

I have a XPS1530 and I have had nothing but problems with it.  I have had 4 motherboards replaced, the LCD screen, the touchpad and palm rest and it still continues to be a problem.  As I said in an earlier post, Dell has put my account on hold for doing any more fixes because I have had so many problems.  Now I know why.... because of the GPU.  Last week I was using it and I started smelling something burning and it got really really hot and shut off.  I am afraid to use it now but as of yesterday Dell refuses to service it because of the problems I have had.  That is very very sad customer care.  Ditching me when I need it and it's not my fault.  I don't know what to do.  I have a valid warranty until January 2010.  Any body have any suggestions?

Hi Lionel, thanks for the information. It is really useful. 

I have been experiencing the problems  (lines on screen, no video), but the Dell technician did not suggest to change any parts, but to update to Bios A12.

I have a question, you were saying that if I was having any of the problems mentioned above (lines on screen, no video), then updating to Bios A12 would not help. Am I right?

So what should I do? Call the Dell technical centre to ask for a change of parts?

Could you please offer some advice on this matter? Thank you.

Mark, if you switch to a Mac, make sure you think twice before buying the current MacBook Pro with the NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT.

I am an inspiron 1420 user with an warranty that expired 3 weeks ago...N amazingly the laptop somehow intutively knew all this and has started givin me GPU problems since then...Wat Do I do??? Isn't it Dell's responsbility to extend my warranty n replace me the part since there was a serious manufactring defect in the piece that was shipped to me....(BTW..I am an ex Dell Hardware support employee from India....and am seriously awaitin Dell's policy on this....) Just wishin Dell lives upto it's name...

I was all lined up to purchase an XPS m1530, after reading about this problem & seeing no response from Dell I'm now shopping elsewhere

The hours I've spent putting together the best system for my needs and budget are not completely wasted, I will be looking for a similar system - just not with Dell.

I need a laptop now & am not prepared to wait any longer to find out whether or not Dell are shipping new builds with this faulty hardware

Mark

I'm pretty sure problems go back way fruther than the stated nvidia generation. Ask any owner of a Dell Inspiron XPS Gen 2 who used the  nVidia GeForce 6800 Ultra card in it and played a game like Oblivian how long it was before their machine couldn't boot up. Its nice to see Nvidia/Dell fess up publicaly to nvidia problems but it would be better if they acknowledged just how far these problems go back.

Hi there,

I did not read all comments (sorry) so i may repeat what has been already said.

I Just want to give an account of what happened to my d630. Yesterday morning, i suddenly began to have strange video behaviours (garbled screens, vertical lines, no image at all) and operating systems crashes (and other strange symptoms but i won't detail them here, it's not the point). I contacted dell support (in France), and they proposed to change the motherboard. This has been done this morning, so i can praise the professionnalism of their support. But the bad news is that changing the motherboard upgraded my bios from rev A03 to rev A12, the revision which is supposed to fix the nvidia gpu problem. Since i restarted my laptop, about 1 hour ago, the fan has been running continuously at full speed.

This is very noisy. Before the update the fans were much more silent. And how long will i be able to work on batteries now, since the fans are always on? I don't call this a solution, merely a way to make sure that the next gpu failure will occur past the warranty expiration.

Lionel has a bit more information for everyone regarding this issue.

You can read his latest update here.

I have two Dell desktops and two Gateway laptops.  I wanted to buy my son a Dell laptop for college this fall.  Based upon what I am reading about the graphics problem I have decided putting off buying a Dell right now until Dell can assure new purchases will not be affected.  I have not seen any assurance at this time.  It maybe time to switch to a MAC.

My inspiron 1420 is showing those unfortunate symptoms and is out of warranty. I find it ridiculous that i have to spend 50 dollars to talk to a technician regarding this issue, since it is known that these parts are defective. I know Dell is not entirely at fault here, but i find it disappointing that their customer service so far has been lackluster and frustrating. Please do the right thing and extend our warranties like HP.

Is anybody from Dell reading this stuff? Any help at all for us poor Linux users?

It's been just a week since the last update from Dell, I expect they may have another update after the weeken, or at least that's what I hope.

I've just got my new XPS M1330 on Friday, and so far so good, downloaded the latest BIOS (A12), the latest driver of Nvidia (via Windows Update).

The 3 year guarantee that I've brought does give me a bit of peace of mind.  Plus, I was talking to the helpdesk yesterday (regarding a MediaDirect problem which has been fixed), the service was really good.  So, I'm trying not to worry too much and enjoy a bit of my new notebook.

Nonetheless, really eager to read the next update from Dell.  Hope they'll do the right thing!

"I know there are many other questions out there. When there are more details to share, I will blog about them here. Until then, thanks for your continued patience. I apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused."

Now, we customers need a clear response.

* Are all the nvidia 8400 & 8600 GPU in Dell notebooks faulty ?

* When will an hardware solution be found, and non-defect hardware be shipped with new built or repaired Dell notebooks on the affected lines ?

For that we know, all the new motherboards with nvidia GPU are faulty. But sold yet.

* Will Dell extend our warranty like HP does ? (aka Is the BIOS trick just delaying the failures to push them out warranty ?)

* When will this problem be recognized on all-level in Dell international support ?

European customer, non-english speaking, are also affected. But French support doesnt seems to be officially "aware" of that gpu problem, and french customers ...

* What about other parts failure due to too high functionnal temperature ?

Some hardware parts, like the harddrive, may see their lifelength reduced with the GPU problem. Are these second effects failure effectivly constated ?

Dell need a real answer to these questions, now, and not only on this little blog, but on the main international Dell sites.

I purchased two Dell Vostro 1400's in July 2007 and both of them have had their NVIDIA 8400gs video cards fail. I sent the laptops in to Dell to be "repaired" around April 2008 and they are starting to show signs of failing again. Both of the laptops came back in less than proper condition as well. One of them has a wobbly power jack, creaking display hinge, and raised plastic portions near the power button which is a result of hasty reassembly by the Dell service center. Of course now they are outside their warranty period. I have started warning many of my friends and colleagues who are thinking about purchasing Dell products and this is an especially poor time for negative customer feedback since it is back to school buying season. This is a really poor showing for a company that used to have respected customer service.

Don't believe that your computer is fixed just because you send it in to be repaired.

I was considering buying a new XPS m1330 from Dell, but the lack of a statement regarding whether new laptops are being shipped with the GPU problems fixed, is keeping me from doing so.

This lack of a statement is obviously a tell tale sign that they plan to continue to rack up profits from their plethora of defective GPU's they have in stock now.

Lionel: There is one set of questions that you need to answer clearly that you have yet to. Perhaps you think you have by implication, but you need to state it in unequivocal terms.

That set of questions is this: Are new laptops shipping with unaffected chips (NOT with affected chips + BIOS patch)? If a warranty replacement is made, will the new board be guaranteed to have unaffected chips?

I guess in the bitter end, AMD is still better than Intel..mmwwhuhahahahahahahaaaaa...

Abahuab said:

Building up customer loyalty is very hard and costs a lot of time and money. Losing it is very easy and happens in virtually no time.

This is so true. Nvidia has shown me that they are not a trustworthy company and I will never again buy any products which contain their products. Hopefully Dell will resolve our concerns with these defective GPUs. I myself will never do business again with any company which makes me feel they cheated me out on my hard earned money.

Note that Dell WILL NOT confirm their "support" of these affected notebooks in writing. When I asked them to via email, they refused. When I pressed the issue, they looked up my phone number in their database and called me--specifically ignoring my request that the confirmation be IN WRITING and going out of their way to elave a paper trail.

Their warranty/purchase agreement doesn't provide for verbal modifications of the warranty terms, does it?

My "NVIDIA-powered" D630 motherboard was recently replaced due to significant increase in fan noise after the A12 bios "upgrade". After the on-site tech raced out of my driveway and I settled back in I noticed that the fan noise was actually at the same level. A check of the bios revealed that my new motherboard was running the A8 bios. Just to be sure, I contacted Dell Gold Support and was instructed to take the bios up to A12. Done, but with no change. The tech apparently replaced the motherboard AND the CPU/GPU combo fan. I have "before and after" pictures of the GPU die and all but the individual serial numbers are the same...this is the same GPU.

Still unhappy about the sudden increase in noise I called support once again and was told that anything with the GPU was now ruled out since the mainboard had been replaced. The tech took remote control of my system and uninstalled the Microsoft ACPI Component System...leading to a reboot and the rediscovery of all attached devices, including the GPU. No change in the fan noise.

My problem has apparently been diagnosed as a "software issue" and I'm about to shut down my PC and install the "fresh" HDD I was sent to perform further testing. I'm getting that sinking feeling of having made a terrible decision and wasted over $2000 on a Dell notebook PC.

I'm almost willing to make the trade up/down to the Intel IGP...no questions asked...but is Dell willing?

Don't ask Dell because it is obvious that they will not answer your questions! Just tell your friends and family not to buy laptops with nVidia video cards anymore until they come clear of the problem and the solution. This will cost them more than not telling the truth!

I bought a XPS Dell (1530), a "upmarket" laptop, and i hope that Dell solve the problem, not to update BIOS, replace defective cards for other model. If they don't do this, I will not recommend it to anyone who buys Dell

I guess Dell is waiting for people to get tired with the issue, watch their machines break, throw them in ebay and pay a mass of money for new ones. This will be the end of this story. Oh, and of course, in the light of customer loss, the numbers of people who would not buy a Dell again should not move Dell much compared to the expense of replacing faulty parts. I am playing devil's advocate, of course, but looking at the situation so many days after the first announcement, I can not see anything positive happening.

I have three Dell Vostro 1310 laptops with this problem. I'm not applying the BIOS patch as I don't want to hear the fans all the time. I have no need for the NVIDIA graphics.

I would like a downgrade on all three laptops to Intel integrated graphics. I can't see any other reasonable solution here.

However... any changes to the laptops will be a real pain. One is being used as a server, one is my day to day laptop, and another is a colleague's day to day laptop. Any downtime for any of the three machines is going to be massively disrupting. How long do such changes usually take? How long do we end up without usable machines for?

hmm...my xps 1330 works just fine though it shows very high temperatures - peak levels at 92C (chipset) measured by I8fanGUI. GPU peak level is about 72C. Im thinking of bying an active notebook cooling pad... 

It's funny, after a few years of having problems with HP notebooks, I decided to buy a Vostro 1400.  Now HP has made good for their customers and Dell still has us in limbo.  Good timing, eh?

I know you guys are working on a solution, but people are watching this very closely. I don't care if your lawyers have to put nvidia under to recoup the costs...  Please, please, please make good on this.

I just finished an hour long discussion of the nVidia GPU issue with a Dell support agent.  I have a 8400M in my laptop.

I asked for the operating temperature range for the 8400M GPU and was told that Dell does not have that information.  I was told to contact nVidia for that information because Dell does not make the GPU.  I instructed the agent that Dell is providing the support for my laptop and not nVidia.  I was told that Dell provides "support" but what I am asking for is information and that is not provided.

I was then told that unless my laptop has shutdown due to thermal failure, the GPU must be operating within specification.

When I pointed to the nVidia's SEC filing, I was told that my chipset was not faulty.

http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1045810/000119312508145974/d8k.htm

I referred the agent to the limited warranty policy and was told that unless my chipset actually fails, Dell will not consider it defective.

What is covered by this limited hardware warranty?

This limited hardware warranty covers defects in materials and workmanship in your — our end-user customer's — Dell-branded hardware products, including Dell-branded peripheral products.

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/policy/en/policy?c=us&l=en&s=gen&~section=010

I told the agent that I am concerned about the affects the faulty GPU will have on the lifetime of my other components and asked who I can discuss my concerns with.  I was told nVidia.

Dell does not consider these GPUs faulty...

...and the BIOS update is the solution.

It's getting ridiculous. I start to worry about my warranty since it's going to expire less than a month. I am not going to pay for it because of Dell/nVidia's defective hardware that it's probably going to die sooner than it should. That's not our fault, they're sold like this. I paid over $2000 for my M1330. I expect it to last at least 4 to 5 years until I replace it. Why HP can respond to their customers and have their solution announced few weeks ago, but Dell still can't do anything about it?

Well, of the many Dell laptops we have purchased, the only two that are affected by this problem are the two that I use......  An M1330 and a 1520.

Both run very hot, so hot that they're uncomfortable to use as a laptop. When I called "customer service" earlier this year and complained about it, I was told, in broken english, that the temperatures were normal....

I updated the bios on both, and in checking the temperatures on the M1330, so far it is running at exactly the same temps that it did before the bios update.  I haven't tried it under a full load yet, I'll do that later.

Fortunately, I purchased extended warranties for both of these machines, but I am still unhappy with the amount of heat the machine's give off, and also the idea that either may fail at any time,  which of course could happen during a critical business trip when I need my computer.

I'm not hopeful, but Dell should do the right thing, and either offer a different, similarly spec'd chip as a replacement, or at the very least, a downgrade to integrated graphics.

do the  nvidia cards in the latitude e line have this issue?

Still nothing new.  This is getting old Dell.

DELL WE NEED A SOLUTION!!

Like many others, I posted on the previous blog on this site regards this issue. As I spoke of then, I see fewer and fewer responses from affected end users which only encourages the "powers that be" in the Dell corporate infrastructure to maintain a closed mouth on a true help for those of us who can least afford this.

It's very obvious if the issue was limited in scope that Dell would say so. I understand their trepidation for as many as are affected, they could ill afford to alienate such a large portion of their target purchasers.

I find it also obvious Dell has no intention to make a move similar to what HP did by offering extended warranties to affected customers. I inquired about additonal warranty coverage and was quoted $174 US per year of additional coverage - Hardly free or even reduced.

The $2400 I spent on my M1530 in June (which represents a full month of my fixed income) was accepted by Dell in bad faith. They knew they were selling me and thousands of others a defective product. My 21 day window for a return was exceeded by the time I was aware of the situation.

While I may have been taken, I am not bashful. I will do whatever I must to insure that Dell is held accountable. Not for making a bad GPU (as that is Nvidia's liability) but for selling a known defective product - One they continue to sell as I type this. To be blunt, that isn't just bad business, that is fraudulent.

Yes, I have rights Dell and I don't want more than I paid for but I do expect a reasonable response to make good on your actions. Your relative silence to this point has been deafening and for the few die hards like myself that will pursue any lawful means at resolution, the ball is in your court. Do the right thing.

I bought a dell xps m1330 with nvidia 8400 in may. im not going to update it to the latest bios because of the mentioned fan problems which reduce battery life. I have one year warranty, will my laptop be covered even if I dont upgrade the bios?

I have bought a new Inspiron DELL notebook in a computer shop, but after I cheked the hard disk there are many video files ( 80% aprox. ). Are my Notebook secondhand ? Can you give me a comment about my notebook?Teresya

Is this why the new line of notebooks that replace the Inspiron have ATI cards in them?

Are you sure the Inspiron 1720 isn't affected?  I bought one almost 9 months ago and the first time I had a problem was after only 2 weeks. I've had the GPU replaced a total of 5 times now. And it failed for the 6th time again this week.

This time I was made to send it in so they can try and find out why it keeps breaking, for which I'm told they'll need 5 working days. Clearly the person we spoke to at tech support had no idea about this issue. I was also told that this is the last time they will fix it and the next time (and I have no doubt there will be a next time) they will replace it.

Replace it with what? The 1720 is a discontinued model. And I can see why!  WIll they give me one they have that was unsold that has the same flawed graphics card that's going to fail around once a month? Or the model they're now selling in it's place which doesn't have a nVidia card?

I would be more than happy to pay the difference between this and the model that replaced it. I am so tired of having to take time off work to wait for a technician to come and fix it. And they hardly ever turn up on the day they're supposed to. Next Business Day service has never been the next day in my experience. I just want a notebook that isn't going to break every 4 or 5 weeks. Is that so much to ask?

If this is true...

http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/12/nvidia-g92-and-g94-gpus-failing-too/

NVIDIA G92 and G94 GPUs failing too?

by Donald Melanson, posted Aug 12th 2008 at 1:33PM

As if the whole defective NVIDIA GPU situation couldn't get any more confusing, The Inquirer is now reporting that the previous batch of bad GPUs may be far from the end of NVIDIA's problems. Apparently, four unspecified board partners are now saying that they're seeing G92 and G94 chips going bad at "high rates" as well, and in both desktop and laptop cards no less. That includes 8800GT, 8800GTS, 8800GS graphics cards, "several mobile flavors" of the 8800, "most" of the 9800 suffixes, and a few 9600 variants, all of which are based on the G92. As for the G94, it seems the only card affected is the 9600GT. Of course, none of this is nearly as set in stone as the previous lot of problems, but we have a sneaking suspicion this won't be last we hear about it.

Is the new Nvidia Quadro FX 370M in the new Precision 2400M also affected? The only thing worse than seeing flawed chips continuing to be used is to see a new chip with a known flaw.

To all those saying that people should stop whining and buy extended warranty, are you serious?  Why do I need to buy extra warranty to make sure that I'm covered for a KNOWN DEFECT?  Especially one where you have to replace the entire motherboard?  I've contacted everyone but Michael Dell to find out if the problem has been resolved and so far has gotten nothing!  Warranty is for UNEXPECTED PROBLEMS, and it's inconvenient not having a computer while waiting to get it fixed.

When I buy something, I expect that the vendor is selling me something that works, on good faith.  Dell is still selling laptops with these GPUs but have not come out and say that the problem has been fixed.  I agree that the blame is on Nvidia for screwing up, but I hold Dell responsible for continuing to sell these defected parts (and I guess expect people to buy extra warranty).  Seems like a scam no?

@John D

I hate to break it to you, but your 8800, which uses a G92 chip, may develop problems as well. 

Nvidia G92s and G94 reportedly failing

Nice to see an update, though I don't see any new information. I've yet to see anything about the Inspiron 1520, which uses the same 8400m gs and 8600m gt GPU as other laptops. I'm also wondering how Dell is addressing these issues and how Dell is fixing problems people are already seeing. For example, if my Inspiron with the 8600m gt is having those issues now, and I send it in for a fix, just what is the fix? Is Dell simply replacing the GPU with a different GPU that probably has the same defect? If that's the case, is warrenty on that GPU a year from the fix on? Because I certainly don't want to see my laptop have the GPU replaced by another one that'll fail in less than a year.

I just bought an M1730 off of the outlet site, mainly because it wasn't affected by the 8400/8600 issue.  Oh, and the fact that it had the dual 8800M GTX SLI config for around $2k.  Go Dell Outlet!

Anyway, this seems like it's on Nvidia more than Dell.  To the people whining about warranty, Dell is famous for letting you extend your warranty after purchase.  I just bought mine with the 2 year plus CompleteCare.  Near the end of that 2 years, all I have to do is ask myself: "Would I rather pony up the extra cash, or has it depreciated enough to make it not worth it?"

Other than the GPU failures, what Nvidia really needs to do is make GPUs that can actually play games, other than dual 8800s.  I had a Toshiba with dual 8600s, and it wouldn't play TF2 or UT3 very well.  It's about time that a midrange single-card solution can actually play modern games, albeit not with all the settings turned up...   The 8400 and 8600 series are so gimped, I would not recommend them at all.

Bottom line: if you don't own one of these laptops, consider integrated video anyway, since the 3d capabilities of the low-end GeForce M series are a joke...

Hm, I just bought an extended warranty 2 weeks ago, because I was worried that I will need it if Dell doesn't do anything about it. What happens now? Can I get back some of the money or extend the warranty even further?

I've now had my m1330 for about 6 weeks. Interestingly, under Ubuntu, I haven't had any of the issues Lionel describes (except once, while I was trying to install the A12 BIOS update!). However, I have routinely had high temperatures, and ACPI thermal shutdowns (automatic shutdown tripped when the ACPI temperature exceeds 104 C). For instance, today, trying to watch the NBC olympic feed, with my computer on the desk (solid surface, plenty of space around the fan outlet, low ambient temperature), I had two over the course of about 2 hours. The only solution that I have found for this problem is to set the ACPI speed-policy to "maximum power saving" which effectively runs the processors at 800 MHz instead of 2.4 GHz. While I really like the M1330's size and weight, bright screen, etc, I purchased it with the intent to do occasional CPU- and graphics-intensive work. As a result, the apparent solution to this problem (return the computer for one with integrated graphics, and run the processor slow) seems somewhat unattractive.

I just had my motherboard replaced by an on site tech on my XPS 1530, prior to the replacment I had zero issues.  Now it seems that I am getting random lines and extreme heat.  The first step I completed after the replacement was to update the bios.  I hope that there is a bigger fix then to enhance the fan usage.  Good Luck to all that are in the same barrel.

Im wondering; there are still several laptops being offered by dell that have the 8400/8600.  I am wondering does this defect effect current models still being offered by dell or does this defect only apply to older models.  Is there a date when defect was fixed?

I am a little confused on this.

P.S. - Just to add to my above posting.......

I don't blame Dell for the defective chip.  I just blame them for continuing to sell it, after the defect is known.  I feel a bit slighted, to have been knowingly sold a defective GPU.  It should have been pulled off the shelves, yet it is still being sold.

Blackheron,

I paid a pretty penny for the 3 year extended warranty(along with Accidental).  If they are offering a warranty extension, I feel I should be entitled to a refund for the warranty I paid for, or have my warranty extended beyond the 3 years.  I can't imagine speaking to the India based Customer service is going to accomplish either one of those options, but I suppose I will try.  They normally can't comprehend the point I'm trying to make.

And even they do accomidate me with one of those options, like you said....the problem isn't actually solved.

I guess I have a few weeks to make my decision.  Really disappointing.

How ironic.

I mentioned in the previous posting on the issue that it would be awful to have the GPU fail just after the warranty runs out.

Guess what happened today?

Yep, two days after my 1 year warranty ran out, the screen started displaying weird artifacts. As of 30 minutes ago, I've pronouned my M1330 as unusable. The laptop crashes continuously, most of the time not even making it into Windows, other times getting there and crashing a couple minutes later.

I am in the middle of university final exams (summer semester) and I've had to borrow an old laptop from a friend just to continue my studies. I know my frustration should be directed at the root cause of the issue - NVIDIA, but it's hard not to be at least a bit angry with Dell, especially given my high stress situation.

I eagerly await word on what Dell is planning on doing for those who are out of warranty.

Found this bit of information interesting ...

Nvidia G92s and G94 reportedly failing

http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2008/08/12/nvidia-g92s-g94-reportedly

^ Chris...

Call Dell customer care, tell them you are concerned, they will extend your warranty like they did with mine. I just received my M1330 yesterday, I called them last week before it arrived and they extended the warranty. Sure, that doesn't solve the problem but at least it's covered and will provide ample time for them to do a physical hardware replacement.

So.....Why can't Dell(Lionel) respond to any of these questions?  I ordered a m1530 that should be delivered this week.  I'm seriously considering returning it within the 21 days and buying from another manufactuer, in order to avoid any problems down the line.  If Dell can't give us some REAL answers within my 21 days, some reassurance, some warranty info, etc, I will be returning it, without a doubt.  I'm not in the business of paying this much money for a laptop, to be left hanging out to dry.  A pitty.

Regards,

Long time Dell customer.

My company is a Dell reseller, and I am out in the cold with my M2300.  The thing is a doorstop as far as I am concerned.

I had the GPU issue before it was well known and had the mainboard replaced.  About 3 days before I found the first blog about the issue, it started happening again.

I did the BIOS update, but I am afraid I am too late.  It is awful again...screen blanking out all the time.  I use docks at the office and home, so I really only notice it when I am travelling and really need my laptop.

I had a plan to buy a 4300, but now I find out that chip is on the affected list too.  I have a developer who has that machine and has had no trouble.

I am in a bind.  I was onsite at a client yesterday and the screen kept blinking and then going out completely.  I ended up having to put it on the network and use remote desktop from one of their PCs.  I then got hounded about the fact that I sell Dell products and “what happens when this starts happening to our PCs?”

If Dell would clarify that the replacements going out are not a problem, I'd be fine.  However, if it is a case of "do the BIOS update and then we'll replace the bad one and hope for the best", that's not good.

The question remains whether or not systems with a separate card (like my Inspiron 1720) are also affected by this isssue.

It looks like only systems with integrated GC's are affected.

Is there any chance that Dell will clarify this in the short run?

I don't know if I'm allowed to post this but I was looking into a m1330 as well and I trusted dell in making decent machines... not the best but at least the best bang for the buck.

My desktop is homebuilt and I do like it cool and quiet. I wouldn't like to have a laptop with hot palmrests and a loud fan.

Here in Belgium a Vaio SR19VN costs almost exactly the same as a similary configured  m1330 but... they offer  centrino  2 +  a mobility radeon hd3470 instead of the 8400m gs. That's a 1933 3dmark 06 score   vs. 1365 for the 8400m gs. I guess there shouldn't be any heat problems as well.

http://vaio.sony.be/view/ShowProduct.action?product=VGN-SR19VN&site=voe_nl_BE_cons&pageType=Accessories&category=VN+SR+Series

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Graphics-Cards-Benchmark-List.844.0.html

Sorry dell but I am seriously tempted by that offer...

Some of you might find this funny, but I sort of expected this ridiculous answer when emailing Dell tech support for a question about this issue.

All I did was email asking if there was some utility or other manner in which to tell for sure if the 8660MGT in my Vostro 1700 was affected by the NVidia manufacturing problem....

The comedy begins with...

...Thank you for contacting Dell Warranty Support.

I understand you are having concerns about the 8600MGT video chips on your Vostro Notebook 1700.

Basing on the information you have given me, I see no issue on it. In fact, that 8600MGT video chips is fully tested on your portable found on problems on it and it is also recommended by DELL. If there is any issue with that video chip you will be notified.

And then to make it even funnier, the tech that responded added this tidbit of non-helpful information...

Also, it is recommended to update your 8600MGT chip by going to this site:

http://www.nvidia.com/Download/index.aspx?lang=en-us

From that site, select:
Product type: GEFORCE
PRODUCT SERIES: GEFORCE 8
Operating System: WINDOWS VISTA 32bit
Language: ENGLISH

Follow the online instruction.

Anyone who has ever tried to download portable graphics chip drivers directly from either of Nvidia or ATI knows that you can't normally do this, AND... he gave the link to the NON-portable chipset drivers.  I  find all of this amusing and not at all unexpected as a canned answer from overseas support agents.

All it did for me was confirm that I do want to return my machine to Dell before it blows up.